Well, we're in the final days..... but each day has now become the equivilant of a month! I'm so uncomfortable, that all the complaining in the world won't help (but i'm still going to do it... hah). I'm starting to feel anxious about having a second child.... can I handle it? What have I done?? What if he's not healthy? What if the baby had colic?? I'll go crazy... the usually confident self has been traded in for an uneasy, doubtful version of me. I'm feeling like... like up until this point it's been a very nice "concept" to be pregnant, and be carrying our second child, but the pregnancy had been more of a medical condition, so-to-speak, than an actual, real life, baby growing inside me that I will now me stuck with caring for, for the REST OF MY LIFE! Okay, that was a little overkill, but it's hard to grasp the enitre concept until it's almost here. It's almost as if at times, I'm outside myself, looking in.... at this life that I don't know. Time seems to have gone by so fast and for as long as I can remember, I've always "dreamed" of being a wife and a mother and having children, but it was always just that.... a dream. It's almost as if I never expected the day to actually come when it would be a reality. So when I have a second to breathe, I sometimes sit and reflect on it all.... and it truely baffles me... like someone hit the fast forward button to my life and I missed all the transitional periods where you have time to get used to and adjust to the major changes that are happeneing. I know that I lived everyday and I was there both physically and mentally, but sometimes I feel as if that was just a movie, or a dream and that I'm actually just a teenager, single, under the care of my parents..... immature and unqualified to ACTUALLY be living that life. You would think that this would've happened with the first child.... and it did, to an extent, but it's really hitting me this time around. I guess that with two kids.... you're a full-fledged family. You are a mother of TWO, not just one. You've graduated to the second teir of motherhood.... where you're 100% entrenched. With one baby, it's acceptable to still have "a life" and it's usually possible. You could concieveablly still be a little immature, selfish, and you haven't fallen into that category yet where you have to drive a minivan or wear horrible jeans. Especially if you're young, a lot of your friends are still living that post college, pre-marriage lifestyle with minimal responsibilities and lots of disposable income. When you have one child, they can steal you away for a night here and there and you don't yet feel like a 80 year old in a college bar.... but with TWO kids.... it's almost as if, no matter what age, you're mentally at LEAST a middle-aged, mom-jean wearing, mini-van driving, 100% RESPONSIBLE, homebody. Society kind of stears you down the path to permanent maturity with a one-way ticket to unexcitement. Oh, I know... it's not all true.... plenty of "mothers-of-two" have wonderful, chic, exciting lives..... BUT.... also, plenty of "mothers-of-two" go out and buy their first minivan.... settle for unflattering "mom" jeans, never wear a bikini again... and think of an exciting night out as a dinner at the local family-friendly restaurant. Now, there is ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with this. There is nothing wrong with being a responsible, family-oriented, van-driving women, but when you feel as if your fast-forward button was hit, and you're actually NOT supposed to be there yet, it can make the transtition like jumping naked into the deep end of a pool in the middle of January. My natural instinct is to kind of pretend like it's not all real.... I think that's why it hasn't hit me until this point, that this thing inside me is going to one day, be my son.... a living, breathing, human being that will walk and talk and eat and poop and one day learn to drive and have his first kiss and hopefully, have a wife and kids of his own. Now see... that's WAY too much to grasp at this point, because if you think about ALL of that, then all of the sudden you're 68 and a grand parent and life is almost over. Then what? What if you still feel like someone hit that fast-forward button and you're actually meant to be in your mid 20's, living life as a free spirit, with a fully-functioning body and mind, and nothing tying you down. I don't want to wake up one day and realize that's what has happened. How is it that you take each day and embrace it so that you don't one day wake up like that?? How do you take each day and engrain it in your memory, so that when you ARE 68 and a grand parent, you can honestly look back and feel as if you lived every moment in between? I hope that the secret comes with age and I just haven't found it yet.
Now, although this has mostly been about time flying.... it feels as if these last few days are FROZEN in time. I can't WISH it away fast enough. I have 10 days until my scheduled c-section and 10 days sounds like 10 YEARS!!! I feel like someone has punched my in the stomach, AT ALL TIMES, and I even cry it hurts so bad... not to mention, when you don't sleep, NOTHING is fun...... NOTHING. I know there is "an end in sight" but it seems as if that end is just a dream.... kind of like one of those things you've always thought about, but will never really happen. I know I should cherish these last few days with "the final" baby inside me.... feeling him kick and roll and practice for the olympics, but I'm finding it hard to have a positive attitiude about ANY of this discomfort. This kid's gotta be a good 15lbs! Okay, I exaggerate, but you all should know that about me by now. My ankles are so swollen that I've been wearing flip-flops in 30 degree weather, my bladder is so smushed that I pee about 3 times an hour.... if not more... and like I said, sleep?? HAH.... I forget the meaning of the word! I am cranky and a big PITA at this point, i'm sure. I feel like an inadequate mother b/c I can't hold my daughter as much, and things like bending over to give her a bath is such a production that I actually dread it every night. I need the magic pill that makes all the negative go away, time fly (for now at least), and a positive attitude shine through. I feel handicap... and I have a new found respect for anyone with a little extra weight on their bodies. I can't sit, I can't lay, standing is okay for my belly, but not my legs, walking hurts, bending is near impossble and my ability to do anything below the waist is gone.... SOOOOOOOOO, as much as I'm not mentally ready to graduate to the second tier of motherhood and become a 100% responsible, mini-van driving, bad jean wearing, family-oriented mother of two..... I'm physically ready to get this DARN baby OUT!
And I can't wait to meet him..... :) I should also add, that my life is a dream... a fairlytale.... I just can't believe it's here already.
Saturday, March 6, 2010
Tuesday, March 2, 2010
Pregnancy and the booze biz
Yet again... I've returned to my negative ways... but it's not my fault. I blame my job. Normally, I would have to say I have it made.... my job has every perk a girl could want... flexibility, no set work hours, a boss who doesn't see what you're doing 4 out of the 5 days every week, and best of all....free booze.... How hard can it really be to walk in and out of bars all day, tasting people on the newest vodka or helping a restaurateur select wines for their wine list.. or helping a retailer decide how much to buy at the end of the month before an item goes off post (post=sale for all you non-liquor biz peeps). How taxing can it be to sit in a sales meeting every Friday and sample an array of new products... arriving home by 5pm with a slight hangover. On the surface, it's the perfect job. The opportunity to make a TON of money selling a product that will NEVER go out of style or be out priced or fall through the cracks. No one ever runs in the other direction when they see YOU come through the door... with your bag full of samples, you might as well be Santa clause. BUT....... (because isn't there always a "but")
But in the competitive ( or should I say cut throat, Rambo style) world of the booze biz, no slack is cut for those who are pregnant. At first, everyone is so intrigued to hear you're pregnant (like... is that possible? You sell liquor, it can't be!). So,.. it sparks a slight increase in sales for about... oh... 5 minutes. Then, in this male dominated business, the sharks come out. It's like the smell of fresh blood in the water... they've all come to feed, and they bait is your accounts... the business you've worked so hard to build becomes the prey. Since most of the sales reps are male as well as most of the retailers/restaurateurs being male, they don't think with their heads... (or at least not the right one) and most have only hearts made of stone (if any at all). The first thing that crosses all their minds is... "weakness". Pregnant = weakness which is followed by the inevitable doubt that you will return. So here you are, 3 months pregnant with something the size of a pumpkin seed inside you and you might as well have had both legs amputated, a mental break down, and a lobotomy. You've already been written off, and every day that you show up is more of a shock and annoyance than expected. Now let me back track for a minute and explain that most business is obtained through a sort of totem pole seniority. The longer you've been servicing an account, the higher on the totem pole you climb which in turn gives you more and more business. Also, just like all sales, the better the relationship you have with your accounts, USUALLY, the more business you get. BUT... (there's that damn word again), there is little to no "loyalty" in this business. It's more of a "what have you done for me lately" business. So, as you can see... you can work and work and work your butt off to build this relationship, climb that totem pole, and one slip-up or one doubt can bring you crashing down to the floor. You get these retailers/restaurateurs (mostly male... I will reiterate) that get what I like to call, "the GOD complex". With over 4 major companies and numerous non-major companies vying for their business like..... well, like sharks in a feeding frenzy,... just knowing that they have the control and the power to decide who gets what, the ability to impact the cash flow to each person directly, these people learn to TORTURE you! Some will dangle the carrot of business in your face only to rip it away and give it to your competitor for no reason at all... or any reason. There are NO guarantees, nothing is ever set in stone, and you can certainly NEVER fully trust ANYONE. Now, couple that with a company who makes promises to the "big guys" fondly known as "suppliers" (those would be the companies who own/distribute brands like captain, ketel, and smirnoff... to name a few) on behalf of you, the lowly sales rep..... promises that sometimes mean sacrificing your first born to make happen.... placements and case sales all about 4 times higher than reality would dictate.... you soon become a magician, or so your boss will think, and the answer "not possible" is never acceptable. I often use the term, "Okay, I'll just sprinkle my pixie dust to get THAT one done!" meanwhile, you're out 'til all hours of the night, picking up the dry cleaning for an account just so he'll take in a QUALIFYING placement of the new $50 dollar a bottle bacon vodka (I hear that's actually coming, by the way). Sometimes, I check my back to make sure I don't have a "kick me" sign on it... So to sum up my pretty picture you've got the pressure from above, the "whataya gonna do fer me now's" and the sharks circling around you at all times..... and that's NOT being pregnant. Now, add it the pregnant part and that weak glue that seemed to keep it all together, that delicate juggling act of keeping everyone happy while fighting off predators, it all comes crashing down!!!!
Like I said, first they're all intrigued and some of the women may even show signs of being "supportive" but family life doesn't fit nicely into competitive sales of ANY kind... especially booze. How can you sell it if you can't drink it? She couldn't possibly know what's good or not if she can't even try it! That's obstacle # 1. Then there's the whole trying to work through morning sickness thing, which I described briefly in my first post..... like running a marathon after a night of tequila drinking. So, you call your accounts a couple of days that you just can't bear to lift your head up and all of the sudden, you're deemed "Unreliable". Now, try shaking THAT title. Then, as you get further and further along, there are more and more doctor appointments and although the schedule is flexible, people aren't always as much... and someone who you usually saw at 11am on Wednesday mornings, you have had to move, every so often, to 12pm on Wednesday afternoons which to them, makes you look like the worst sales rep b/c something is OBVIOUSLY coming before them. Then there's the notion that ANY time a mistake is made, it's automatically b/c you just don't care anymore.... b/c you couldn't possibly be career minded AND pregnant... nope, not possible. Being surrounded by men doesn't help, either.... For the most part, from the CEO's right down to the package store employees, most of these men have never had to be the primary care taker for children... even if they have their own. So even if they TRY and sympathize, it never actually gets through to them and you end up becoming the stereotypical pregnant woman eventually... and to add in having another child,... the whole thing becomes compounded. Life's full of complications, ruined plans, good intentions that no one ever sees, but what you're judged on in this business is not so much what you've done, but what they THINK you've done, or not done.... I would love to pose the question to any judgemental male with a wife and kids of his own.... "what would you do if your wife's boss or accounts (in my case) gave her a hard time for staying home with your sick 1 year old??" "What would you do if people assumed your wife didn't work hard because she had to call some accounts due to being so sick that she couldn't leave her bed.... or maybe because she had to get a 2nd ultrasound done b/c there might be something wrong with the baby's heart?" "What would you do if YOU had the flu and were too sick to work and someone deemed YOU 'Unreliable' because you called out for a few days?" "What would you do if you saw your wife running out at all hours of the evening to pick up checks or take orders while 9 months pregnant, after you've witnessed her not sleep for 3 days straight now.... or after she's been up all night with your sick toddler?? and if she refused, how would you feel when these people called her boss or gave her a hard time or made her feel bad,as if she'd never measure up.." "How would you feel if when your wife returned to work after maternity leave, numerous of what she thought were 'loyal' accounts, dropped her b/c of her decision to stay home and raise your child for the first few months of it's life?" "What would you do if you had to see her cry over people's assumptions that she doesn't care, despite seeing the fight she still has that no one else seems to take notice of...??" or how about... "HOW WOULD YOU FEEL if this were YOU?????"
In so many professions, this is the unfortunate case. You become a liability, an annoyance, a problem, a headache, a hurdle, and an easy target. Me personally?? I'm F'n sick of it! And here's my warning b/c I'm about to get a little riled up.... Here I am 9 f'ing months pregnant.... walking around in pain EVERY DAY that I don't tell anyone about (except my poor husband), giving it MORE than my all b/c I don't want to be perceived as not working hard enough and what happens???? I get dicked over, preyed upon, targeted, given up on, and JUDGED to be a lost cause.... to name a few. My boss has already written me off and I'm pretty sure he's already started searching for my replacement... my numbers are so down b/c no one thinks they're going to have to face me, or they assume that I don't care, or they hold it against me that I've been having to call more often than usual (rather than show up in person), and they give the business away. Then, as a result, My bosses think I suck and look at me like I'm a poor excuse for an employee or tell me that I'm not pulling my weight. I love my job, I love to work hard at my job, but when the health of my baby or my child is in jeopardy, that will supersede a sales call. Doesn't anyone see that my family will always come first and that this is something that should be commended????? NO, instead they'd all rather have me be a horrible, alcoholic, workaholic mother who leaves her kids at home all night so that I can go out an spend money in my accounts to "show my loyalty" and drink my products. They would like me to be available at all hours of the day and night to make sure that they don't run out of jager or that their bills are paid... they want my mind and my physical abilities to be that of superwoman and will accept nothing less... no excuse is good enough, or okay and there should NEVER be a reason to not be 100% on top of my game. I'm not legitimately unable to work, oh no... I'm just Lazy! Well Fuck THAT! I'm not their accountants, but I do my best to make sure they pay their bills on time, I'm not their employees, yet I make sure to keep track of their inventories.... shouldn't there be a thank-you?? Instead, they just tell me how disappointed they are in me when GOD forbid, something happens and I slip up. No big deal, I'm just in labor, but I'll be right there to pick up that check and deposit it in the bank so you can get your two sleeves of jager tomorrow. But for what?? It's not like they're going to "take care of me" while I'm out.... or when I get back... nope, half of them will dump me like a bad habit and almost none of them will even remember my name in a month. Do you think they're going to protect MY income or MY business while I'm gone?? Do you think they're going to give any thought to if I'm able to pay MY bills or if I have enough for formula and diapers?? I highly, highly doubt it. I haven't even left work yet to get cut open and begin the adventure of being a mother of 2, and I've got competitive men going into my accounts telling them I'm not coming back. Maybe I shouldn't.... when does it become too much to handle? When does it become not worth the fight??
I know I shouldn't care what anyone thinks... I do my job well and that should be all that matters, as long as I know it in my heart,... but it's becomming hard to measure up to these mile high expectiations and maintain a positive attitude when all the feedback is negative. In a time where all I need is a stree FREE environment... it seems like everyone has turned up the heat! No one seems to care that I'm carrying a full term baby around. I shouldn't be worrying if bar x's bills are paid, I should be worrying about having a healthy baby... but instead I can't help but obsess that I only hit 91% of my quota last month and that i'm being squeezed out of my second biggest account..... Here I am days from delivery and I can't even focus on putting a nursery together b/c all I can't think about is how I'm going to fix this crap before I leave!
Okay, i'm stopping... I could go on and on and on and still not be satisfied.. fact of the matter is, it's not going to change by typing in a blog!
Uh... I'm so ready to be done with work for a few months.... then maybe when I return to the shit storm, I'll have a little more tolerance for it. Sorry, I know that most of you will not have made it past this first paragraph, but for those of you who did and are thoroughly bored, I apologize.... this was more for me than anything else. I just needed to vent.... now I should re-read it and make sure it even makes sense!
But in the competitive ( or should I say cut throat, Rambo style) world of the booze biz, no slack is cut for those who are pregnant. At first, everyone is so intrigued to hear you're pregnant (like... is that possible? You sell liquor, it can't be!). So,.. it sparks a slight increase in sales for about... oh... 5 minutes. Then, in this male dominated business, the sharks come out. It's like the smell of fresh blood in the water... they've all come to feed, and they bait is your accounts... the business you've worked so hard to build becomes the prey. Since most of the sales reps are male as well as most of the retailers/restaurateurs being male, they don't think with their heads... (or at least not the right one) and most have only hearts made of stone (if any at all). The first thing that crosses all their minds is... "weakness". Pregnant = weakness which is followed by the inevitable doubt that you will return. So here you are, 3 months pregnant with something the size of a pumpkin seed inside you and you might as well have had both legs amputated, a mental break down, and a lobotomy. You've already been written off, and every day that you show up is more of a shock and annoyance than expected. Now let me back track for a minute and explain that most business is obtained through a sort of totem pole seniority. The longer you've been servicing an account, the higher on the totem pole you climb which in turn gives you more and more business. Also, just like all sales, the better the relationship you have with your accounts, USUALLY, the more business you get. BUT... (there's that damn word again), there is little to no "loyalty" in this business. It's more of a "what have you done for me lately" business. So, as you can see... you can work and work and work your butt off to build this relationship, climb that totem pole, and one slip-up or one doubt can bring you crashing down to the floor. You get these retailers/restaurateurs (mostly male... I will reiterate) that get what I like to call, "the GOD complex". With over 4 major companies and numerous non-major companies vying for their business like..... well, like sharks in a feeding frenzy,... just knowing that they have the control and the power to decide who gets what, the ability to impact the cash flow to each person directly, these people learn to TORTURE you! Some will dangle the carrot of business in your face only to rip it away and give it to your competitor for no reason at all... or any reason. There are NO guarantees, nothing is ever set in stone, and you can certainly NEVER fully trust ANYONE. Now, couple that with a company who makes promises to the "big guys" fondly known as "suppliers" (those would be the companies who own/distribute brands like captain, ketel, and smirnoff... to name a few) on behalf of you, the lowly sales rep..... promises that sometimes mean sacrificing your first born to make happen.... placements and case sales all about 4 times higher than reality would dictate.... you soon become a magician, or so your boss will think, and the answer "not possible" is never acceptable. I often use the term, "Okay, I'll just sprinkle my pixie dust to get THAT one done!" meanwhile, you're out 'til all hours of the night, picking up the dry cleaning for an account just so he'll take in a QUALIFYING placement of the new $50 dollar a bottle bacon vodka (I hear that's actually coming, by the way). Sometimes, I check my back to make sure I don't have a "kick me" sign on it... So to sum up my pretty picture you've got the pressure from above, the "whataya gonna do fer me now's" and the sharks circling around you at all times..... and that's NOT being pregnant. Now, add it the pregnant part and that weak glue that seemed to keep it all together, that delicate juggling act of keeping everyone happy while fighting off predators, it all comes crashing down!!!!
Like I said, first they're all intrigued and some of the women may even show signs of being "supportive" but family life doesn't fit nicely into competitive sales of ANY kind... especially booze. How can you sell it if you can't drink it? She couldn't possibly know what's good or not if she can't even try it! That's obstacle # 1. Then there's the whole trying to work through morning sickness thing, which I described briefly in my first post..... like running a marathon after a night of tequila drinking. So, you call your accounts a couple of days that you just can't bear to lift your head up and all of the sudden, you're deemed "Unreliable". Now, try shaking THAT title. Then, as you get further and further along, there are more and more doctor appointments and although the schedule is flexible, people aren't always as much... and someone who you usually saw at 11am on Wednesday mornings, you have had to move, every so often, to 12pm on Wednesday afternoons which to them, makes you look like the worst sales rep b/c something is OBVIOUSLY coming before them. Then there's the notion that ANY time a mistake is made, it's automatically b/c you just don't care anymore.... b/c you couldn't possibly be career minded AND pregnant... nope, not possible. Being surrounded by men doesn't help, either.... For the most part, from the CEO's right down to the package store employees, most of these men have never had to be the primary care taker for children... even if they have their own. So even if they TRY and sympathize, it never actually gets through to them and you end up becoming the stereotypical pregnant woman eventually... and to add in having another child,... the whole thing becomes compounded. Life's full of complications, ruined plans, good intentions that no one ever sees, but what you're judged on in this business is not so much what you've done, but what they THINK you've done, or not done.... I would love to pose the question to any judgemental male with a wife and kids of his own.... "what would you do if your wife's boss or accounts (in my case) gave her a hard time for staying home with your sick 1 year old??" "What would you do if people assumed your wife didn't work hard because she had to call some accounts due to being so sick that she couldn't leave her bed.... or maybe because she had to get a 2nd ultrasound done b/c there might be something wrong with the baby's heart?" "What would you do if YOU had the flu and were too sick to work and someone deemed YOU 'Unreliable' because you called out for a few days?" "What would you do if you saw your wife running out at all hours of the evening to pick up checks or take orders while 9 months pregnant, after you've witnessed her not sleep for 3 days straight now.... or after she's been up all night with your sick toddler?? and if she refused, how would you feel when these people called her boss or gave her a hard time or made her feel bad,as if she'd never measure up.." "How would you feel if when your wife returned to work after maternity leave, numerous of what she thought were 'loyal' accounts, dropped her b/c of her decision to stay home and raise your child for the first few months of it's life?" "What would you do if you had to see her cry over people's assumptions that she doesn't care, despite seeing the fight she still has that no one else seems to take notice of...??" or how about... "HOW WOULD YOU FEEL if this were YOU?????"
In so many professions, this is the unfortunate case. You become a liability, an annoyance, a problem, a headache, a hurdle, and an easy target. Me personally?? I'm F'n sick of it! And here's my warning b/c I'm about to get a little riled up.... Here I am 9 f'ing months pregnant.... walking around in pain EVERY DAY that I don't tell anyone about (except my poor husband), giving it MORE than my all b/c I don't want to be perceived as not working hard enough and what happens???? I get dicked over, preyed upon, targeted, given up on, and JUDGED to be a lost cause.... to name a few. My boss has already written me off and I'm pretty sure he's already started searching for my replacement... my numbers are so down b/c no one thinks they're going to have to face me, or they assume that I don't care, or they hold it against me that I've been having to call more often than usual (rather than show up in person), and they give the business away. Then, as a result, My bosses think I suck and look at me like I'm a poor excuse for an employee or tell me that I'm not pulling my weight. I love my job, I love to work hard at my job, but when the health of my baby or my child is in jeopardy, that will supersede a sales call. Doesn't anyone see that my family will always come first and that this is something that should be commended????? NO, instead they'd all rather have me be a horrible, alcoholic, workaholic mother who leaves her kids at home all night so that I can go out an spend money in my accounts to "show my loyalty" and drink my products. They would like me to be available at all hours of the day and night to make sure that they don't run out of jager or that their bills are paid... they want my mind and my physical abilities to be that of superwoman and will accept nothing less... no excuse is good enough, or okay and there should NEVER be a reason to not be 100% on top of my game. I'm not legitimately unable to work, oh no... I'm just Lazy! Well Fuck THAT! I'm not their accountants, but I do my best to make sure they pay their bills on time, I'm not their employees, yet I make sure to keep track of their inventories.... shouldn't there be a thank-you?? Instead, they just tell me how disappointed they are in me when GOD forbid, something happens and I slip up. No big deal, I'm just in labor, but I'll be right there to pick up that check and deposit it in the bank so you can get your two sleeves of jager tomorrow. But for what?? It's not like they're going to "take care of me" while I'm out.... or when I get back... nope, half of them will dump me like a bad habit and almost none of them will even remember my name in a month. Do you think they're going to protect MY income or MY business while I'm gone?? Do you think they're going to give any thought to if I'm able to pay MY bills or if I have enough for formula and diapers?? I highly, highly doubt it. I haven't even left work yet to get cut open and begin the adventure of being a mother of 2, and I've got competitive men going into my accounts telling them I'm not coming back. Maybe I shouldn't.... when does it become too much to handle? When does it become not worth the fight??
I know I shouldn't care what anyone thinks... I do my job well and that should be all that matters, as long as I know it in my heart,... but it's becomming hard to measure up to these mile high expectiations and maintain a positive attitude when all the feedback is negative. In a time where all I need is a stree FREE environment... it seems like everyone has turned up the heat! No one seems to care that I'm carrying a full term baby around. I shouldn't be worrying if bar x's bills are paid, I should be worrying about having a healthy baby... but instead I can't help but obsess that I only hit 91% of my quota last month and that i'm being squeezed out of my second biggest account..... Here I am days from delivery and I can't even focus on putting a nursery together b/c all I can't think about is how I'm going to fix this crap before I leave!
Okay, i'm stopping... I could go on and on and on and still not be satisfied.. fact of the matter is, it's not going to change by typing in a blog!
Uh... I'm so ready to be done with work for a few months.... then maybe when I return to the shit storm, I'll have a little more tolerance for it. Sorry, I know that most of you will not have made it past this first paragraph, but for those of you who did and are thoroughly bored, I apologize.... this was more for me than anything else. I just needed to vent.... now I should re-read it and make sure it even makes sense!
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